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ViceRegent

Is the universe infinitely old, violating the second law of thermodynamics, or did the universe arise by natural means out of nothing, violating the first law of thermodynamics.  You have no third alternative.  If you wish to state there is a third alternative, state your scientific or philosophical credentials.

Ampersand

ViceRegent said:

Is the universe infinitely old, violating the second law of thermodynamics, or did the universe arise by natural means out of nothing, violating the first law of thermodynamics.  You have no third alternative.  If you wish to state there is a third alternative, state your scientific or philosophical credentials.

Are you aware of how space-time works? If not I suggest you wiki it for a simple explanation.

Your argument assumes causality - which under standard conditions is a no-brainer and would be a standard assumption. Unfortunately for your argument, prior to the big bang when space was compressed to a single point, that also means time and hence causality did not exist.

Although we cannot condense all matter into a single point to test the theory, this is the expected outcome based on Einsteins theory of special relativity and we can test that in more measurable ways to check that it confirms with reality.

ViceRegent

Time and causality did not exist because the space occupied by the universe was really small?  ROFL. I would ask this dude to prove this, but he has admitted in another thread that he has no way of knowing if he is delusional or not.

ViceRegent

Atheists despise science and logic.

Ampersand

You don't seem to be able to offer an argument in response besides your own personal skeptism. Do you have any actual evidence or logic to dismiss space-time - a scientific theory which disproves your claims and is backed up by experimental results?

ViceRegent

Dude, without proof, your claim needs no argument in response.  We do not argue with the deluded.  We feel sorry for them and confine them.

Ampersand

Special Relativity has been proven. as mentioned above, if you are not familiar with the concept the easiest thing for you to do is just wiki it to get a basic understanding as I suggested:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_relativity
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tests_of_special_relativity

Also if you aren't familiar with a subject, you shouldn't make unsupported claims about it as you'll often be wrong - as evidenced by your claim that there is no proof for special relativity when it is actually something scientists have been finding proof for for over 100 years as described in the links above.

ViceRegent

ROFL.  Let me help you out.  Prove time and causality cease to exist when matter occupies little space.  ROFL

ViceRegent

This question always stumps the pretend atheist scientist.

Ampersand

I provided you with links explaining the evidence and math supporting the theory. Do you have an evidence or logic rebuttal?

ViceRegent

I am not interested in your question begging links.  I am asking you to prove your claim that time and causality does not exist when matter occupies a tiny space.  You have one more chance to provide this proof or I will infer you have none and are bound by anti-science atheist mysticism.

ViceRegent

One of the ways you can tell you are dealing with a pretend scientist is that they Wikipedia is scientific proof.

MayCaesar

Laws of thermodynamics are statistical facts applied to a specific volume. "Before" the Big Bang, there was no volume, as there was no space, hence the laws of thermodynamics do not apply to it.

Laws of thermodynamics are not strictly "laws" as is a fundamental property of the Universe. They simply describe the fact that statistically large numbers of objects subjected to the same evolution rules are extremely likely to be found near the peak of the probability distribution, than anywhere else. This is what the entropy growth is about (with time, matter spreads more and more uniformly around the Universe statistically), this is what the temperature equalisation is about (speeds of atoms are likely to be well mixed up, and very unlikely to have an ordered structure after a long period of mixing), and this is what the entire field of thermodynamics is about.

Analogy: suppose you have 1,000,000 pennies. You toss them all into a vending machine and turn the machine on. After a while, you turn it off and, picking penny by penny up, calculate how many heads and tails there are in the machine. With incredibly high probability, the number of tails will be very close to 500,000. It can be 499,500, it *could* be 499,000 - but it will not be 400,000 realistically, unless you used uneven coins.
Same here. There is no physical law prohibiting, say, two reservoirs put near each other to maintain a difference in temperatures. But in probabilistic terms, this will not happen, and when you return a few days later to measure their temperatures, the temperatures will be very-very close, well beyond our ability to measure the difference.

I would recommend doing a bit of self-educating before trying to dismantle the results of centuries of research by millions scientists with a short online argument.

sear

OK:

 a) This thread has been around for 3 years, and is still on page #1.

 b) the topic is: 

Question for Anti-Science Evolutionists

 Isn't evolution science?

      

calebsica

Evolution is not science even though they try to make it science. There is no evidence for evolution. it violated the conservation of angular momentum. 

Dee

@calebsica

Evolution is fact , most rational beings except this the exception being some religious evolution deniers mainly Americans unfortunately 

John_C_87

sear said:

OK:

 a) This thread has been around for 3 years, and is still on page #1.

 b) the topic is: 

Question for Anti-Science Evolutionists

 Isn't evolution science?

      

@sear ;

The only thing that has change on this cartoon is scale. The map is now of the universe, and the Ship is now a starship.

AmericanFurryBoy

Thats] sounds like an oxy moron