The best online Debate website - DebateIsland.com! The only Online Debate Website with Casual, Persuade Me, Formalish, and Formal Online Debate formats. We’re the Leading Online Debate website. Debate popular topics, Debate news, or Debate anything! Debate online for free! Trump decision to send the military to the border is illegal.in Politics

YeshuaRedeemed

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act This act dictates that the military not use force on American soil.

MayCaesar

The act is much trickier and more complicated than that. Technically it prohibits the army from enforcing the domestic law, albeit there are multiple exceptions and special clauses that make this prohibition a little more vague. Some lawyers also interpret it as applying only to American residents/citizens.

The border laws are only partially the domain of the domestic law, and illegal immigrants that have no American residence also can be an exempt from the mentioned act.

The idea of this and similar acts is (and has always been) to make sure that the government cannot use the military force in order to usurp power and suppress dissent. When the military force is used against foreigners that, according to the president's narrative, are "invaders: - then the circumstances (at least the way the executive branch interprets them) are obviously different.

As such, it is not clear whether Trump's decision is technically illegal or not, and on various law forums you will find countless debates on this matter, with both sides providing very compelling arguments. This is the case where the interpretation of the law is not very clear. It is the job of the Supreme Court to classify Trump's decision as legal or illegal, should a respective request be submitted to the court.

What is for sure is that this decision, whether technically legal or not, creates a bad precedent. The Founding Fathers warned that the dictatorial overtake is likely to happen not as a result of sudden usurpation of power, but, rather, a gradual encroachment on people's freedoms, a slow and steady increase in the involvement of the military sector in the civilian matters. This could very well be one more step towards materialization of those warnings, and the nation should make it clear that this sort of action is not acceptable. Unfortunately, given how loyal Donald's supporter base is, I do not think they will see the possibility of eventual military dictatorship as connected to this decision in any way, so here we are.

CYDdharta

Not entirely accurate.  The president can use military forces inside the US to put down invasions and insurrections.

§333. Major public emergencies; interference with State and Federal law

(a) Use of Armed Forces in Major Public Emergencies.—(1) The President may employ the armed forces, including the National Guard in Federal service, to—

(A) restore public order and enforce the laws of the United States when, as a result of a natural disaster, epidemic, or other serious public health emergency, terrorist attack or incident, or other condition in any State or possession of the United States, the President determines that—

(i) domestic violence has occurred to such an extent that the constituted authorities of the State or possession are incapable of maintaining public order; and

(ii) such violence results in a condition described in paragraph (2); or

(B) suppress, in a State, any insurrection, domestic violence, unlawful combination, or conspiracy if such insurrection, violation, combination, or conspiracy results in a condition described in paragraph (2).

https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2006-title10/html/USCODE-2006-title10-subtitleA-partI-chap15.htm

YeshuaRedeemed

@MayCaesar President Trump does not have the right to use force with the military on American soil. You will not change my mind that easily.

TTKDB

The thing about Trump, he's the President, and he's doing things as the President that the previous Presidents maybe haven't done before, and some of the public isn't used to that?

TTKDB

When you look at the some of the other previous Presidents, when has the "entirety" of the public agreed with what some of the them did, during their times in office? 

YeshuaRedeemed

@TTKDB That is not a valid argument, try again.

YeshuaRedeemed

@TTKDB I don't care, try again.

TTKDB

@YeshuaBought

This is from the military times, maybe it will help to clarify some things?

https://www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2018/10/31/federal-law-limits-what-us-troops-deployed-at-the-border-can-do/ ;

TTKDB

If an individuall is in the military, they are going to go where the Commander in Chief, and their Chain of Command, directs them to go.

They are defending and supporting the Constitution. 

TTKDB

https://www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2018/10/31/federal-law-limits-what-us-troops-deployed-at-the-border-can-do/

CYDdharta

TTKDB said:

https://www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2018/10/31/federal-law-limits-what-us-troops-deployed-at-the-border-can-do/

It seems odd to me that an article titled "This federal law limits what US troops deployed at the border can do" doesn't mention the federal law or explain the limits in any detail.  Then again, I really don't expect much from AP.

Nathaniel_B

YeshuaBought said:

@TTKDB I don't care, try again.

You see, there is no convincing her. She is just ignorant and can't make an ACTUAL argument on why Trump shouldn't send U.S Troops to the border. I'd be surprised if she actually did, but then again, Its not like it will really happen right?

TTKDB

There is a distinct possibility that some in the military across the country may have inquired to their various chains of command about volunteering to go down to the border to help the other soldiers who are already there with the developing mission. 

ken285

@MayCaesar ; President Lincoln used the military to move native american indians to reservations! He also approved a bounty on indian men women and children who were found outside of reserved indian land! All this because the indians refused to become citizens and give up their land! He did all this at the same time he signed the emancipation proclamation!!! You don't have to go far to find this information out on line. However don't expect this to be regularly taught in schools or universities!!! There is no real debate in most colleges!

John_C_87

First it is not the Military that Executive Officer Trump can send it is realistically now called the United States Armed Forces. The United States Military was politically quarantined unconstitutional by accusation of discrimination based on gender. A woman cannot be admitted legally to the United State of military in an honorable fashion using simply democratic vote as means to insure the relief of obligation a military hold on United States Constitution. However this is not the real topic of debate.

The United States Armed Forces are not sent to enforce State Law they defend Constitutional law, they are sent to restrict the invasion of a foreign force on a united state in order to defend a United States Constitution itself. Mexico would need to make an official declaration, in writing, in the form of travel visa describing their citizens as a civilian, none Militia, or they can simply be instantly returned to Mexico. The obstacle to liberty created by civil war has become militia out of uniform globally.

At least in a United State of Constitution. Though I would not say this is the only United State held by constitutional principle in this matter.