what does socialism mean to you?
in Politics

billbatard · June 2019

Do you think there is one set definition of has the word been misused for so long people really dont know what it is..

Dee · June 2019

Well to me anyway it should mean an interest in the welfare of those who make up society of which we are all part off. A while back I stated on a debate site that I thought so called civilized societies should have social welfare , affordable housing and free healthcare systems in place and if not should be aiming for this at least.

Where I live I’m entitled to all these things, also a mother whether working or not is entitled to a monthly allowance for her children at €140 a month per child and every citizen is entitled to a state pension of €250 on retirement along with any private pension they may have, a reduction on fuel bills , free tv license and free bus and rail pass are also given to every citizen as a right. I’m an artist , the state values artists and as such I only have to pay 1 per cent tax.

During the crash when my country was on its knees all these entitlements were still paid.

My country is nor perfect but I find these systems laudable even though we are a capitalist country these systems are what to me anyway every society should have as the welfare of all citizens greatly benefits society.

I don’t mean to offend but normally I’m shouted down by Americans who call me a “commie , a red , or a Stalinist “ which I find hilarious and the ones that normally do it are the bible thumping idiots who actually claim when challenged that Jesus would have been against , Universal health care , social welfare and of course would have been all for carrying a gun.

Fortunately I’ve also conversed with many Americans who are of a like mind to me and who are also branded by their fellow countrymen as “commies “ .

billbatard · June 2019

@Dee i consider myself an ethical socialist, and or a chritian socialist it is ironic for anyone to say jesus was against sharing wealth how can anyone say that ?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5k6_ZJRjwbs

ZeusAres42 · June 2019

Image: https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/60655598_2221948324520635_971028750563016704_n.jpg?_nc_cat=104&_nc_ht=scontent-lhr3-1.xx&oh=6bf6a29389e531f37034813fc66ab533&oe=5D86404C

I like to think of myself in the middle.

Sharky · June 2019

It is sad and unfortunate that so many people all over the world are naive enough to believe that socialism translates to "a society that takes care of one another". Karl Marx' definition of socialism was a transitional system between capitalism and communism marked by increased authoritarian government control over the means of production along with greatly expanded redistribution of wealth orchestrated by government. Socialism was never meant to be permanent; communism was.

Too many people fail to recognize how socialism and communism mesh with basic human nature to diminish and eventually crush the natural drive that people have to achieve, innovate and succeed. The incentives that abound in capitalist systems are largely eliminated, destroying peoples' initiative and enthusiasm for productive work. Once the public learns that being a laggard pays pretty much the same as being a workhorse, most people give up on the idea of putting forth extraordinary effort to produce. The result is a greatly diminished GDP and a corresponding reduction in the general standard of living. As misery spreads, effort dissipates and government oppression increases.

In addition to the damage done to peoples' natural work ethic, socialism and communism tend to incentivize the worst elements of societies to rise to the top of the power structure, hence the rise of history's worst and most murderous despots like Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Pol Pot and Castro. When these kind of people see the opportunity to seize and hold power, they take it. When that power is threatened, they ruthlessly crush their opposition, often resorting to mass murder.

It's hard to believe that people still subscribe to the idea of socialism despite its horrific track record of failure, misery and death over the course of the last century. We need to do a much better job teaching the true history of this abomination.

Akhenaten · June 2019

Communism is a capitalist concept. Communism was created and conceived by capitalists. Refer to The Creature from Jekyll Island - A second Look at the Federal Reserve by Edward Griffin.
Thus, the whole thing of capitalism and communism being opposites is not true. Capitalists societies created the communist system to get free slave labour. Thus, world wars 1 and 2 were opportunities for communism to begin.
At the end of World War I communist Russia began. At the end of World War II communist China began.
Russia was not considered to be a successful communist country because it is too cold and near Europe.
Thus, a second world war was necessary to create another communist country which would be more isolated from the world and not so cold.
Soon after the end of world war II industries started pouring into China which became a haven for multinational industries who would have an endless supply of cheap labour.
Note - Banks steal from people by the use of a fractional reserve. The money that people earn is constantly being diluted by a steady increase in the amount of new money being printed by the banks. People work their whole lives to pay off a never ending debt due to inflated house and land prices. Thus, most people are slaves to the few rich families that control the system.

republicans · June 2019

Socialism is horrible. It sounds good in speech but in reality, it just doesn't work out. Democrats especially Bernie Sanders who is an idiot, wants to turn the U.S. into a socialist country. Democrats are trying to rip this country away from what it was founded on and it is not right.

George_Horse · June 2019

Socialism to me means:

Failure
Oppression
Totalitarianism
Hunger
Death

Isn't socialism SOOOO great guys? Ahhhhh that good ol Cold War!

George_Horse · June 2019

Socialism to me means:

Failure
Oppression
Totalitarianism
Hunger
Death

Isn't socialism SOOOO great guys? Ahhhhh that good ol Cold War!

George_Horse · June 2019

Socialism to me means:

Failure
Oppression
Totalitarianism
Hunger
Death

Isn't socialism SOOOO great guys? Ahhhhh that good ol Cold War!

George_Horse · June 2019

Socialism to me means:

• Failure
• Oppression
• Totalitarianism
• Hunger
• Death

Isn't socialism SOOOO great guys? Ahhhhh that good ol Cold War!

MayCaesar · July 2019

It is basically the ideology based on envy and anger, advocating for taking away from those who have "more" and giving to those who have "less", one way or another.

It is not very different from imperialism, stating that those who have something you do not have to be conquered and made to give you this something. The only difference is, imperialism deals with lands, and socialism deals with individuals.

It comes from a toxic moral ruleset and leads to unspeakable horrors on the societal scale, but it has a certain appeal in the eyes of some people who secretly dream of having more and doing less simultaneously. It is easy to sell to misguided masses, hence it is still popular, even in the capitalist societies that have achieved unprecedented success exactly due to discarding the socialist ideas.

Socialism is not something to be considered seriously. It is something to laugh at while drinking wine with friends; this is where its usefulness ends.

TKDB · July 2019

The United States deserves better, than to have a Democratic Socialist, messing with the rest of the country, while appeasing their followers, or fanbases, and themselves.

ZeusAres42 · July 2019

I don't like the idea of any subservience of the state whether it be from the political left or the political right.

TKDB · July 2019

@ZeusAres42

Where and when, have you heard of subservience, being politically pushed by the political right?

Evidence, facts, proof, links?

Because the below, looks like pure opinion?

"I don't like the idea of any subservience of the state whether it be from the political left or the political right."

ZeusAres42 · July 2019

@TKDB

Really? Have you never heard of Hitler? Where have you been all these years?

MayCaesar · July 2019

@ZeusAres42

But Hitler was a socialist. He only differed from traditional socialists in this regard on what social classes get the perks of the wealth distribution, and what classes get punished. Among most socialists, it is the enterpreneurs who are attacked; for Hitler, it was people with undesirable biological traits.
Hitler based his ideas on Mussolini's book on Fascism, and the economical system he described there was pretty much pure socialism, strongly centralised one - unlike, say, the Leninist version, which originally implied decentralised economical activity.

A right-wing dictatorship would be something like Pinochet's regime, or Lee Kuan Yew's Singaporean system: they featured wide economical freedoms and little wealth redistribution, but politically were very restrictive. Note how, while a dictatorship is a dictatorship, the economical freedoms of individuals were still respected.

Hitler is commonly attributed to the "right" because it is a widely held belief that nationalism/racism is a property of the "right" - but it really depends on how you define "right". If "right" is to be defined as individualist ideologies and "left" as collectivist ones (which is how they were classified originally), then Hitler by no means can be attributed to the "right" movements.

piloteer · July 2019

@TKDB ;Pro life legislation is a "subservient" right wing agenda.Family rights over Gay rights is a subservient right wing agenda.Mandatory church attendance is a subservient right wing agenda.(yes. It's a real thing)Anti-global legislation is a subservient right wing agenda.Military actions in foreign countries is a subservient right wing agenda.Overblown defense spending is a subservient right wing agenda.Building a wall along the Mexican border is a subservient right wing agenda.Tariffs on Mexico, Canada and China is a subservient right wing agenda.

@ZeusAres42

To be fair, hitler and the nazis were socialists who embraced the progressives idea of "genetic health", "racial health" and eugenics. hitler was far left.

piloteer · July 2019

I am not sure why "Debra" gave me a 47% considerate rating on my last post. I've said WAY worse $hit on here that has gotten a better rating than that. Debra hates me!!!!!

ZeusAres42 · July 2019

@piloteer

The National Socialist German Workers' Party commonly referred to in English as the Nazi Party was a far-right political party in German.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_Party

TKDB · July 2019

@ZeusAres42

Are we living in the day and age of Hitler, and the Third Reich?

Or are we living in the day and of the present 21st century?

Apparently using Hitler, as a leveraging conversation piece, by some the modern day Liberal leftists, to get over some of the Conservatives, is how some go about making a non talking point, by trying to use Hitler, at their mindful leisure?

ZeusAres42 · July 2019

@piloteer

Some US individuals have said that the EU version of the far right is the US version of the Far left. However, I know that Hitler was far-right as far as the UK and other EU countries are concerned, and as far as Oxford is concerned too for that matter. https://www.oxfordreference.com/view/10.1093/oi/authority.20110803095811414.

ZeusAres42 · July 2019

https://www.oxfordreference.com/view/10.1093/oi/authority.20110803095811414. For reference about Far-right.

piloteer · July 2019

@ZeusAres42

Perhaps that's true, but they also drive on the wrong side of the road in those countries.

Honestly though, what's considered a libertarian in Europe is a form of socialism, but in the US, a libertarian would be vehemently opposed to socialism. But in all fairness, when you replied to TKDB, you were obviously using the US measurement of left vs right.

ZeusAres42 · July 2019

@MayCaesar

https://www.oxfordreference.com/view/10.1093/oi/authority.20110803095811414.

ZeusAres42 · July 2019

@piloteer

Definitions are irrelevant anyway. I am against any subservience of the state whether they come from the left or right in a given country regardless of how else another country might define left or right. My previous response was basically just that; I don't like any form subservience to the state whether it being from the left or the right, or for want of a better phrase, independently of which party is advocating for it.

John_C_87 · July 2019

Socialism is the loss of independence.

Sharky · July 2019

Socialism requires the government to collect vast sums of tax revenues in order to pay for the many expensive programs that a socialist society demands. A country as wealthy as the United States could easily finance the transition to socialism in the short run. However, the problem lies in the long-term unintended consequences that socialism inevitably creates.

Massive tax increases on the wealthy invariably result in those individuals "voting with their feet", taking their money and setting up shop in friendlier environments. After all. when leftists simultaneously demonize and vilify the very people they intend to rely on to pay for all of their exorbitant promises, they create a powerful incentive for rich people to emigrate to countries that appreciate highly productive people and the benefits they bring to a society. As the source of the massive revenues dries up, the leftist politicians will always ramp up the class warfare attacks and put in place more comprehensive, tyrannical and confiscatory tax regimes in order to keep their gravy train running. This begins a cycle where the leftists grow increasingly desperate and radical in order to protect their power and money and the entrepreneurial class take whatever actions they deem necessary to protect and preserve their businesses and wealth. The mutual distrust, hatred and desperation to prevail has throughout history resulted in leftist governments whipping the lower classes into a frenzy of envy and rage and the end result is an orgy of mass murder.

Anyone who thinks this scenario could never play out in the United States is simply naive. I would imagine that millions of people thought it could never happen in France, Russia, China, Cuba, Vietnam, Cambodia or Venezuela, too.

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what does socialism mean to you?
in Politics