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Is the Confederate Flag Racist?
in History
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Arguments
It stands for both racism and proud heritage.
Neo-nazis are very proud of their heritage and also very racist.
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I agree with that.
People say that it's their heritage. And it is.
However, their heritage is built on racism and is such racist.
“We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.” - Benjamin Franklin So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.
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The association of the flag with racist sentiment is a mistake that only serves to reduce the complexity of Confederate motivation and completely obscure the things they were completely within their rights to do.
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to anyone who would argue that this flag does not represent slavery I present a question that if answered will change my view:
Why was it, that when the southern commission for peace talks met with Lincoln to discuss the terms of surrender, their first and only wish was to be readmitted into the union in time to block the ratification of the thirteenth amendment?
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Also, in 1861 the Confederate vice president gave a speech that said: " ... the negro is not equal to the white man ..."
http://teachingamericanhistory.org/library/document/cornerstone-speech/
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/csa_csa.asp
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/csa_missec.asp
“We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.” - Benjamin Franklin So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.
I friended myself!
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This is basically undeniable, as the Confederacy stated that Racism was the reason it existed as a nation.
Fast forward to modernity, and racists groups still use it as their primary symbol. So I'd say it's meaning hasn't evolved much in the past century.
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A flag is made to symbolize a country. A country includes the society and the government/laws itself. As I previously stated above ...
Slavery was mentioned in multiple states secession. Mississippi said, "Our position is thoroughly identified with the institution of slavery ..." The Confederate constitution said "No bill ... or law denying or impairing the right of property in ... slaves shall be passed."
Also, in 1861 the Confederate vice president gave a speech that said: " ... the negro is not equal to the white man ..."
http://teachingamericanhistory.org/library/document/cornerstone-speech/
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/csa_csa.asp
http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/csa_missec.asp
“We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.” - Benjamin Franklin So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.
I friended myself!
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Subjective-based on or influenced by personal feelings, tastes, or opinions.
Objective-(of a person or their judgment) not influenced by personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing facts.
If it was objective it would mean racism
Oh, sorry I did not clearly state my point. It is racist.
“We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.” - Benjamin Franklin So flat Earthers, man-made climate change deniers, and just science deniers.
I friended myself!
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Also I still wan't to know what Confederate flag because they each represent something different to most people.
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"I think a better question is does the confederate flag represent racism because the confederate flag is a flag and does not care who you are:"
The Confederate Flag represents the confederacy.
"Also which confederate flag are we taking about?"
Basically any 'stars and bars' style confederate flag outside the official flag used between 1861 – 1863. But I can only assume this was the original posters intention.
"I don't think that a flag of a society that kept slaves represent slaves."
The entire nation existed to preserve to slavery, as stated by the Confederacy.
"When the civil war started The north was npt trying to destroy slavery."
The North's motivations do not negate the South's motivation for war.
"Some northern states kept slaves longer then the confederate states."
This isn't exactly true, seeing slavery persisted in the South through Sharecropping and the Justice system.
"Also what a flag represents based on the person because it is just a flag so saying it is basically undanible is not that true."
The Flag represented the Confederacy, which existed to preserve slavery. If you can find evidence that it did not represent the confederacy, I'd say you have wiggle room here.
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It can be argued that the Confederacy main motivation was to keep state rights which if the government abolishing slavery it would intrude on. I also mentioned the Northern states not being motivated to destroy slavery because it shows that the confederacy was not only trying to preserve slavery.
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"It can be argued that the Confederacy main motivation was to keep state rights which if the government abolishing slavery it would intrude on. "
It can be argued that the Union main motivation was to keep states rights which the enforcement of fugitive slave laws trampled.
"I also mentioned the Northern states not being motivated to destroy slavery because it shows that the confederacy was not only trying to preserve slavery."
The motivations of the North don't negate the motivations of the South. If the Union fought to maintain an elephant in congress, that wouldn't somehow make the fact the South fought to preserve slavery any less true.
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"There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".
"Oh, you don't like my sarcasm? Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".
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https://www.ajc.com/news/state--regional-govt--politics/photos-they-black-and-they-proud-the-confederate-flag/by06A6ywMrqi7mYP9A1jmO/
Scientific method: noun; a method of procedure that has characterized natural science since the 17th century, consisting in systematic observation, measurement, and experiment, and the formulation, testing, and modification of hypotheses.
The highest form of ignorance is when you reject something you don't know anything about.
Wayne Dyer
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I am the opposite entirely.
I am an anti-fascist fascist. If you adorn a flag that I consider immoral or you burn a flag that represents what I love, I want to make you burn with the flag... I want to show you what a flag is and the respect you owe what it represents.
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Scientific method: noun; a method of procedure that has characterized natural science since the 17th century, consisting in systematic observation, measurement, and experiment, and the formulation, testing, and modification of hypotheses.
The highest form of ignorance is when you reject something you don't know anything about.
Wayne Dyer
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While someone who is using the flag can claim they personally don't attach racist connotations to the confederate flag when they use it, likewise someone can claim that they personally don't attach insulting connotations to flipping someone the bird. Either way, don't be surprised if other people think you are a racist or an asshole.
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If you burn the flag of the nation, the nation you reside in should remove the rights it has granted you.
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The US has the rights of freedom of speech. Burning its flag is practicing this right. Why should practicing a right given to you by your country result in them taking away the right. You are supposed to be able to practice your rights.
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I am not a right-wing libertarian, so come and try again.
There's a ton of stuff people should be punished for saying and the punishment should be teaching them how to become a tolerant, understanding human being.
If I ever ran a nation, I'd be a leader like no other. My people would love me and those who don't would learn to.
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I don't see how burning people who burn the flag teaches people how to be tolerant understanding human beings. I feel like that would be doing the opeset. You can't make some one love you. If they don't like you how can you teach them to like you?
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The discipline to act differently to what you feel like doing is the difference between Floyd Mayweather and Conor McGregor.
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Allow me to bring up an extreme example I've seen on TV a long time ago. In, I believe, Latvia there was a small parade of veterans of World War 2 in Nazi costumes. A reporter was interviewing one of the veterans, and approximately the following dialogue occurred:
Reporter: "Are you not ashamed of celebrating Nazism?"
Veteran: "We are not celebrating Nazism. We are celebrating our fight for freedom from Soviet occupants."
Reporter: "But what about the Nazi costume you are wearing?"
Veteran: "This is the costume I wore when fighting communism. I do not have any love for Nazis, and I would have fought them just as well if needed - but I do have love for freedom and for my history of fighting for it, no matter under which banner."
Just as this Veteran wore a Nazi costume because he treasured his memories, and not because he loved Nazis - people could wave a Confederate flag because they treasure the history and, perhaps, some specific Confederate ideals, and not because they support slavery.
So, the answer to your question is: it depends on the meaning the person waving the flag puts into it. People who get angry over the meaning they themselves put into someone else's flag are simply being emotional or not understanding of how symbols work.
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It stands for multiple things, depending on who flies it. Notice that the Dukes of Hazzard had the Confederate flag on the top of their car. It stood for being rebels.
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For me: It's just a piece of cloth from a historical part in American History
For that triggered SJW in the corner cringing: It represents racism
For a normal southerner: It's heritage
Blues and Raptors handed two very toxic teams embarrassing losses, 95% of the sports world is rejoicing in the news
Repealing the Second Amendment is the first step to Totalitarianism, and it needs to be prevented to protect our freedom
http://www.atheistrepublic.com/
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Blues and Raptors handed two very toxic teams embarrassing losses, 95% of the sports world is rejoicing in the news
Repealing the Second Amendment is the first step to Totalitarianism, and it needs to be prevented to protect our freedom
http://www.atheistrepublic.com/
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Some would argue that the Confederation was a more genuine spiritual successor to the original USA model, than the Union. I am not so sure, since both of them misinterpreted the Founding Fathers' ideas: Confederation went towards extreme violations of individual liberties, and the Union put too much centralization into its system, violating state rights. But regardless, as they say, "History is written by victors". Were the Confederates to win that war, perhaps people would make similar sentiments with regards to the modern US flag, as they nowadays do with regards to the Confederate flag.
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The Confederate Flag, on the other hand, was a "rebel flag", a symbol of those who rejected the United States Flag, It is similar to the Nazi Swastika Flag while the German Flag of the time was also rejected by rebels.
It is NOT the U.S. Flag, the German Flag OR the Cuban Flag that should be denigrated, it's the political groups that chose their own, or chose to use the existing one that should be denigrated! The flags of the Nazis and Confederates, or the traitors to a country are wrong, NOT the Cuban Flag.
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